Comments on: Lost Liturgies File: The Churching of Women http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/ Connecting the dots between Catholic faith and culture Fri, 30 Jul 2010 04:21:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: "Disgusted in DC" http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5705 "Disgusted in DC" Mon, 08 Feb 2010 16:56:22 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5705 On the same day of this post, Fr. John Hunwicke, Vicar of St. Thomas the Martyr, Oxford (C of E), who seems to be personally interested in the upcoming Anglican Ordinariates, wrote an interesting little take on the Churching of Women and the business about Jewish ritual purification. Not sure he is right about the latter, but worth considering .... http://liturgicalnotes.blogspot.com/2010/02/rhythm.html On the same day of this post, Fr. John Hunwicke, Vicar of St. Thomas the Martyr, Oxford (C of E), who seems to be personally interested in the upcoming Anglican Ordinariates, wrote an interesting little take on the Churching of Women and the business about Jewish ritual purification. Not sure he is right about the latter, but worth considering ….

http://liturgicalnotes.blogspot.com/2010/02/rhythm.html

]]> By: Msgr. Charles Pope http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5404 Msgr. Charles Pope Fri, 05 Feb 2010 01:40:32 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5404 Amen John and thanks. Amen John and thanks.

]]> By: John Masslon http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5376 John Masslon Thu, 04 Feb 2010 19:52:43 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5376 David, The Pope would disagree with you. The Vicar of Christ on Earth believes that the 1962 liturgical books ARE current official liturgical books. To say otherwise would be to ignore his speeches, actions, and proclamations. I'd ask you to name one canon lawyer who has articulated the position you argue over the past year. David,

The Pope would disagree with you. The Vicar of Christ on Earth believes that the 1962 liturgical books ARE current official liturgical books. To say otherwise would be to ignore his speeches, actions, and proclamations. I’d ask you to name one canon lawyer who has articulated the position you argue over the past year.

]]> By: Msgr. Charles Pope http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5363 Msgr. Charles Pope Thu, 04 Feb 2010 16:11:06 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5363 Like so many things, the ritual of purification peobably had many levels of meaning for the participants. The Text requiring Jewish women to report was clearly quite negative in its assessment of the need for purification. But like many things, over the centuries layers of meaning and experience were added. Hence, as you point out we can well celebrate this feast of Jesus and Mary. I also agree with your distinction that ritual impurity is not the same as moral impurity. It is a helpful remark. Like so many things, the ritual of purification peobably had many levels of meaning for the participants. The Text requiring Jewish women to report was clearly quite negative in its assessment of the need for purification. But like many things, over the centuries layers of meaning and experience were added. Hence, as you point out we can well celebrate this feast of Jesus and Mary. I also agree with your distinction that ritual impurity is not the same as moral impurity. It is a helpful remark.

]]> By: Kristie Wellman http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5360 Kristie Wellman Thu, 04 Feb 2010 14:51:58 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5360 Dear Msgr. Pope, Thank you for the interesting article! My grandmother has told me before about this ritual, which she unfortunately did seem to experience in a negative way (as if she needed to be cleansed from impurity). I had thought, however, that the purification (needing ritual purification is different from needing moral purification!) even in Jewish times was not something that was degrading but something that recognized the beauty and power of birth. Just as the Jews needed to be cleansed after other life events where they came into contact with blood or bodily fluid, I had thought that this ritual (the Jewish one) recognized the sacredness of life and appreciated the "sacramentality" of the body. Otherwise, how could we CELEBRATE the Presentation of Jesus in the Temple as a feast if we were truly remembering something that was a negative thing? I would love to hear your thoughts on this if you have a chance. Thank you, and God bless you. Kristie Wellman Dear Msgr. Pope,

Thank you for the interesting article! My grandmother has told me before about this ritual, which she unfortunately did seem to experience in a negative way (as if she needed to be cleansed from impurity). I had thought, however, that the purification (needing ritual purification is different from needing moral purification!) even in Jewish times was not something that was degrading but something that recognized the beauty and power of birth. Just as the Jews needed to be cleansed after other life events where they came into contact with blood or bodily fluid, I had thought that this ritual (the Jewish one) recognized the sacredness of life and appreciated the “sacramentality” of the body. Otherwise, how could we CELEBRATE the Presentation of Jesus in the Temple as a feast if we were truly remembering something that was a negative thing? I would love to hear your thoughts on this if you have a chance.

Thank you, and God bless you.
Kristie Wellman

]]> By: bob http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5351 bob Thu, 04 Feb 2010 11:08:41 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5351 Insects are problems everywhere. great article Insects are problems everywhere. great article

]]> By: Msgr. Charles Pope http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5338 Msgr. Charles Pope Thu, 04 Feb 2010 03:18:12 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5338 Yes, great. I am glad that the priests so willingly gave the blessing. Yes, great. I am glad that the priests so willingly gave the blessing.

]]> By: Msgr. Charles Pope http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5337 Msgr. Charles Pope Thu, 04 Feb 2010 03:17:04 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5337 Well I guess I didn't mean that she was in labor the whole time. But there are the final days of preganancy. Then the recovery after giving birth etc. :-) Well I guess I didn’t mean that she was in labor the whole time. But there are the final days of preganancy. Then the recovery after giving birth etc. :-)

]]> By: Msgr. Charles Pope http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5336 Msgr. Charles Pope Thu, 04 Feb 2010 03:15:58 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5336 Yes, thank for this. Another comment also made this point and it is a beautiful way of reconciling the notion of purification with childbirth Yes, thank for this. Another comment also made this point and it is a beautiful way of reconciling the notion of purification with childbirth

]]> By: Cynthia BC http://blog.adw.org/2010/02/lost-liturgies-file-the-churching-of-women/comment-page-1/#comment-5333 Cynthia BC Thu, 04 Feb 2010 01:25:05 +0000 http://blog.adw.org/?p=5444#comment-5333 "...bless a woman who has perhaps been away for a few weeks giving birth..." I shudder to think of a labor that lasts several weeks...15 hours was plenty for me! “…bless a woman who has perhaps been away for a few weeks giving birth…”

I shudder to think of a labor that lasts several weeks…15 hours was plenty for me!

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